Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

[DaKine]

This is a follow up from a previous post. Clicky

I praticaly changed the whole ignition system Less Distributer. Now i have spark, Fuel, but the truck don't start. Just turns and turns.. Killing the battery. Its driving me NUTZ! They should add "pour gas on truck and light with match" in the owners manual. :rant:

I changed the MSD box (which i took to a Shop to bench and ran 100%) Coil, wires, plugs, cap, rotor, ignition module. What now?

I knew that to own a sy is a love/hate relationship. and was prepared for it but these things just kill me. :squint: I love this truck but we having some drama now.. hahaha

 

[NecroWolf]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

got good fuel pressure?

 

[Jimmy]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

Have you checked the ECM-B fuse?

 

[VermontTy]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

Have you checked the ECM-B fuse?

.....and when you do get it started, IMMEDIATELY change your oil please. Dumping fuel in with no ignition will leak past your rings, down into the oil, and make a big headache; sometimes a big BOOM.

 

[myclone]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

.....and when you do get it started, IMMEDIATELY change your oil please. Dumping fuel in with no ignition will leak past your rings, down into the oil, and make a big headache; sometimes a big BOOM.

FWIW the ECM looks for an ignition reference pulse (read back) and if it doesnt see it the ECM will kill the fuel pump after a set amount of time.

My :2cents: is that there is a harness/wiring issue of some type since he stated he can monkey with the ignition stuff and the truck will start (sometimes) then when he comes back later its dead.

It wouldnt hurt to throw an ignition module at it but I doubt thats the issue since Ive never seen a dead one come back to life ever. Its more along the lines of "while Im in there I might as well......." type deal.

 

[VermontTy]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

FWIW the ECM looks for an ignition reference pulse (read back) and if it doesnt see it the ECM will kill the fuel pump after a set amount of time.

This has to mean that in one cranking cycle, it will kill the fuel pump after a while. If you turn the key off, then try to crank again, it must 'reset' itself and look for the ignition pulse again? If not, once the truck didn't start, the ECM would shut off fuel as you say, and the next time you went to start it, nothing would happen because there is no fuel (but there was no fuel because there was no ignition, because there was no fuel, because there was no ignition; dog chasing tail.) Correct, am I missing something here?

 

[bezerk]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

are you rally sure about the timing? no cross wires? timing 180 degree off

 

[myclone]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

This has to mean that in one cranking cycle, it will kill the fuel pump after a while. If you turn the key off, then try to crank again, it must 'reset' itself and look for the ignition pulse again? If not, once the truck didn't start, the ECM would shut off fuel as you say, and the next time you went to start it, nothing would happen because there is no fuel (but there was no fuel because there was no ignition, because there was no fuel, because there was no ignition; dog chasing tail.) Correct, am I missing something here?

Forget what I said since I forgot about the oil pressure switch that supplies the FP with power once the oil pressure comes up. After a few seconds of cranking the oil pressure switch will keep the fuel pump on no matter what the ECM wants the FP to do.

You guys can beat me later...right now Im too tired for my daily beating.

 

[DaKine]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

Thanks Vermont.. i will look into the ECM B fuse once i have the time. Can you tell me where it is exactly so when i do go to look ill get straight there. Thanks

Bezerk: I double, triple checked the spark plug wires and they are correct. As for the 180 thing i didnt touch the distributer, but ill check.

Necro wolf: i will double check the fuel pressure to see if i get enough.

 

[Jimmy]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

Thanks Vermont.. i will look into the ECM B fuse once i have the time. Can you tell me where it is exactly so when i do go to look ill get straight there. Thanks

Bezerk: I double, triple checked the spark plug wires and they are correct. As for the 180 thing i didnt touch the distributer, but ill check.

Necro wolf: i will double check the fuel pressure to see if i get enough.

It's under the dash on the drivers side in the fusebox.It's on the lower left and is marked "ECM-B"

 

[Don W.]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

It is possible to have the dist in right and the wires on wrong, ask me. Bring the engine around to TDC, #1, FIRING stroke. (different techniques here just be sure that it's firing stroke not TDC on the exhaust stroke) Pull the cap and look at the rotor position and make sure that that wire is going to #1. THEN check your firing order from #1.

All that being said if you had spark and were out of time you'd prolly know it; backfiring, starter acting like a dead bat every couple of cyls, other odd noises, ect.

Old saying: If it's got fuel (in the right amount), compression, and spark (at the right time) it'll run. It's gotta be one of those 3.:rant:

 

[bezerk]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

if timing is 180 off, it just crank, and sounds like it's not getting spark/ feul.

 

[DaKine]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

if timing is 180 off, it just crank, and sounds like it's not getting spark/ feul.

i didnt even touch the distributer .. can it move on its own? i can check the TDC and rotor positon.

Wednesday is the next day i have time.

Thanks

 

[James Thomas]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

Have you tried using a scan tool to see if the data stream / ECM communication is ok? Trouble codes? Check it all as these types of problems usually end up being somthing really dumb or over looked. If all else fails, before you get the gas can and matches I'll buy it from you :rotf: !
___________________
James R. Thomas

 

[bezerk]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

take the rotor cap off, spin engine to 0 degrees, and she where the rotor is pointting to, it should point to cilinder #1 or 180 degrees off.
if that's correct, you atleast know for 50% which one is nmr 1
put everything back, try it again, if it only cranks and no backfire or anything, rotate all your plug wires 180 degrees on the dist. and try it again.

still no good?

 

[Jimmy]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

So,um have you checked the fuses? Does your CEL work right?

 

[DaKine]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

So,um have you checked the fuses? Does your CEL work right?

I checked the ECM B fuse and its fine. whats the CEL? tried to start it and still no luck :rant: .. im gonna put a fuel pressure gauge to see if i have enough pressure. Also check to see if the injectors are getting any power. .

 

[Jimmy]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

I checked the ECM B fuse and its fine. whats the CEL? tried to start it and still no luck :rant: .. im gonna put a fuel pressure gauge to see if i have enough pressure. Also check to see if the injectors are getting any power. .

Check Engine Light.If it's not working,your ECM probably isn't either.

 

[DaKine]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

Check Engine Light.If it's not working,your ECM probably isn't either.

it goes on with all the other dummy lights whent the key is turned. Do you think the prom paQ has something to do with this? I've been planning to take it out. And when i do take out the prom-paQ is it a R&R, remove and reconnect the harness to the ecm?

 

[cloneman315]

Re: Still No Luck! .. Why Why Why!

i would def try that